His tombstone says it all.

In 1910 and 1920, John can be found living with his parents in Tazewell, IL. His father was Fred Rosenthall, also listed as J F W Rosenthall and John F Rosenthall. He was born in Illinois, his father in Germany and mother in Illinois. John’s mother was Mary A and in one place, M Alice. She was born in Indiana, her father in Ireland and her mother in Carolina.

In both 1910 and 1920, John is listed with a middle initial. At first I thought it was “H” but I was not able to track him any further. But then I realized it was probably “K” (possibly Kerr, his mother’s maiden name?) and then I was able to find him, I believe, in 1930.

1930. John K Rose is a roomer in the house of Vernon and Elizabeth Plummer in DeKalb, IL. He and Vernon are both listed as Teachers. John K is 24. Now there is no guarantee that this is him, but what makes me think it is is how he answered the questions about birthplaces -- he says he was born in IL, his father in IL and his mother in IN.

In 1940, he and Priscilla lived in Washington, DC. They said they had previously lived in Chicago in 1935 and a stillborn child was reported for them in 1935 in Chicago. John was living in Washington DC when he died in Jan 1974.

I found a biography of him on-line.

Science instructor, tutor, lecturer, instructor in Illinois and Indiana, 1928-1935. Society Science Research Council fellow University of Chicago, 1935-1936. Research associate education George Washington University, 1937-1943.

Lecturer United States Department of Agriculture Graduate School, 1938-1940, Catholic U. American, 1941. Consultant National Resources Planning Board, Washington, 1940-1941. From assistant to senior economics analyst, head economics section Rural Electrification Administration, 1936-1942.

Principal analyst Board Economics Warfare, 1942-1943. Head analyst, chief resources division Foreign Economics Administration, 1944-1945. With Office International Trade Promotion, Department Commerce, 1945-1946, Bunce Economics mission to Korea and Japan, 1946.

Analyst (geographer) Legislative Reference Service, 1946-1955. Senior specialist Natural Resources and Conservation, 1955-1973. Admitted to bar United States District Court, District of Columbia, 1945, United States Court Appeals, 1946, Illinois bar, 1946, Korea bar, 1946.

Partner firm Spaulding, Reiter & Rose, from 1951.

Jim’s Aunt Priscilla gave me some background on John Rose and that has allowed me to make some progress on this branch of Jim’s family.

Priscilla said: John was born John Rosenthall in 1905, he changed his name to Rose. His father was Fred and his mother was maiden name Kerr. She came from Indiana. Fred’s father came from Germany. They lived in Tazewell County, IL.

That’s all it took to find these people in Census and other places. The best find was, of course, his tombstone which gives his name and birth and death dates as well as his parents -- and confirms everything Aunt Priscilla said.

Her name is given in Massachusetts Birth Records as Priscilla Hollis Webster, born 22 Oct 1904 in Cambridge, MA, daughter of Hollis Webster born Milton and Helen M Noyes born Auburndale. Census records prove the relationship. The fact that she named her daughter Helen Hollis provides confirmation.

Until I found this record, I had it that she was born in Lexington and that her middle name was Noyes rather than Hollis. I also in my notes refer to seeing her obituary which I can no longer find.

I am wondering if Lexington and middle name Noyes were in that obituary.

In 1930, she is living in Worcester, MA on her own at age 25 and her occupation is given as Editorial and Research Publisher.

Her SSDI says she died in Topsham, ME. Her Maine Death Index says she died in Brunswick, ME and I found her in a database of phone directories living in Georgetown, ME. They all are in the greater Bath area.

A part of her obituary was printed on Katie and Jim’s wedding ceremony. It refers to Priscilla’s grandmother Helen F Noyes and says she was the first Helen of four succeeding generations. The four successive Helen’s, I guess, must be Priscilla’s grandmother, mother, sister and daughter.

Priscilla was born in Massachusetts and in 1930 was single and living in Worcester, MA. Her husband was born in Illinois and in 1930 was single, living in DeKalb, IL. How did they meet? Where? When? I do not know.

Priscilla died in Maine. Priscilla's great-grandfather -- George Noyes -- was born in Maine, but her obituary says that her grandparents “discovered” the Sagadahoc Bay area in Maine while “touring”.

Stephen, son of Helen Hollis Rose by her first marriage to Leonard Donaghy told me that Priscilla had 7 children: one died very young; the others are Priscilla (Foley, deceased), Susan (Lemp. Boulder CO), Helen (my mother), John (Rolling Prairie, IN), Leonore (Taylor, Kennebunk, ME) and Stephen (Reno, NV), i believe that's in order of birth.